Leaving Software Engineering Job to Invest in Land Full-Time | Mike Apke

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In this episode of The Real Estate Investing Podcast, Daniel & Ron Apke are thrilled to welcome their brother, Mike Apke, who has always had an entrepreneurial spirit.

Inspired by watching Ron and Dan's success in land flipping, Mike knew he wanted to join the world of land investing to achieve the financial freedom that it offers.

Sharing his inspiring journey from working part-time in land investing, Mike reveals that he spent just 20 hours a week on land flipping. It was only recently that he made the bold decision to leave his corporate job and pursue land investing full time.

The full story doesn’t stop there. The three brothers dive deep into the intriguing acquisition of Droners.io, a bankrupt company that many land flippers use for their land flipping businesses.

 

Watch or listen to the full episode below to hear the full story! ⬇️

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Mike: I’ve always wanted a certain level of financial success, um, and a certain level of freedom that really only entrepreneurship can bring you. Um, I think my first entrepreneurial venture was a vending business outside the Cincinnati Red Stadium. I did that when I was like 20 to 22.

Ron: One thing I wrote down here, Dan, and we talk about it so much, is like, friction creates opportunity.

Like, those are the exact words I wrote down.

Mike: The friction. Yeah. I love the friction because it kept out the competition. I think the more friction you have in business who bidders that’s all I talked to some other people that tried to bid but they didn’t have enough money

Dan: That’s what always worried me going into that odd courthouse.

My heart was beating My watch told me I was at like 128 beats per minute like I was in a sports game Yeah, I heard it beating

Mike: like when we were auctioning. I don’t know why I started reaching out to our top clients It was about letting everybody know we’re up and running again and getting them back

Dan: Hey everyone, welcome back to the real estate investing podcast Today, we brought our other brother, Mike Apke, on the show. Mike was a part of our land investing community for multiple years, and he’s really taken his business from a land perspective off the ground. And most recently, Mike, uh, helped acquire Droners.

io with us when we went down to Raleigh and bid, uh, the Chapter 7 foreclosure business and had that whole experience. So we’re going to talk about Mike’s background here. We’re going to talk about how he got to land. Uh, previously, he had some businesses before land as well, and we’re going to get into that.

And then talk about droners, but welcome to the show, Mike.

Mike: Yeah. Thanks for having me.

Dan: The first thing I want to talk about is, um, your, your background, you know, a lot of people make excuses when it comes to business with, they’re too busy and all these other distractions going on. You have a family, you had a W2 job until recently, and we’re going to get into that later in the show, but talk about your background and just what, what really led you here.

Mike: Um, I’ve had entrepreneurial aspirations for a long time. And a few years ago, you guys started land. Uh, you guys started probably a year ahead of me. Uh, I saw the success you, you all were having, um, and I, and I watched that and it made me interested in land. Yeah. Um, beyond that, I’ve, I’ve always wanted a certain level of financial success, um, and a certain level of freedom that really only entrepreneurship can bring you.

Yeah. Um, so that’s always, that’s always brought me in that direction. And even before that, Dan, you and I had some drop shipping business together. Exactly. We did that, Dan. Um, I think my first, um, Entrepreneurial ship, entrepreneurial, uh, venture was a vending business outside the Cincinnati red stadium. I did that when I was like maybe like 20 to 22 Did that for like three seasons where I went downtown got a license, uh did vending downtown before Cincinnati Redskins sold water, Gatorade, peanuts.

Ron worked for me a few times. Double headers in the heat. Yeah. Yeah. And actually made decent money and it was, it didn’t make great money, obviously, uh, but a few hundred dollars a game. And it gave me like a taste for like, it was, it was just fun, like building the business, trying to, trying to grow, putting together new offerings.

Like, like it was just really fun and fulfilling. So that’s really what was my first taste of entrepreneurship.

Dan: So you went from vending and then you got into, uh, how old were you when you were vending? I was like, I think I started when I was 20 maybe. And for those who don’t know, Mike’s the oldest brother.

Someone asked this yesterday, Mike’s the oldest brother, Ron’s the middle and I’m the youngest. So you went from

Mike: 15 years ago, 15 years ago. So you went

Dan: from vending, then you had drop shipping coming on here soon. And you had a W2 during all this as well. And then after drop shipping, you, you went to land.

Mike: Yes.

Dan: Got it. Yes. And what, um, you said the freedom that you got from vending and you got a taste of that a little bit, and then you saw a drop shipping and land and what is that to you, the freedom?

Mike: A big part of it is, is deciding, you know, working for a big company, you only have so much say in the direction of the business, if any at all.

So it’s really deciding the direction of the business.

Dan: Interesting.

Mike: Um, and now, now that I no longer have a

Dan: fulfillment thing,

Mike: yeah, like just, yeah, it’s, it’s, um, yeah, growing, building a business and being the one, not necessarily doing it by yourself, but, but being the one that pushes the business forward and, and I really like being part of the strategic part of businesses.

Dan: Yeah. And what did you see like with land specifically? Because you went to dropshipping, did you see any pros and cons of land versus dropshipping? Or why, what made you make that transition?

Mike: I mean, the dropshipping businesses end up, we made a little bit of money, but they ended up failing and we closed them down.

Um, which is fine. So, so from dropshipping to land, um, land was something I could easily do on the side. Uh, there was a lot of income potential, but I think being able to like, made very good money with land working 10 to 15 hours a week. I, I, there were periods when I was working more than that when I was pushing 20 plus working a lot of nights.

But once I learned the systems and got good at land investing, I would say, I mean, I was working 10, 15 hours a week and making decent money. So it was something I could do reliably on the side.

Dan: Yeah. Yeah. And, and when you started that first business with the vending, you didn’t have a family with dropshipping.

Did you have, you didn’t have a family yet either. With dropshipping?

Mike: No. Uh, I had a wife. But you I didn’t have kids there. Yeah. You were married? Yeah.

Dan: And with um, land, when you started, did you have a family?

Mike: Yeah.

Dan: You had kids?

Mike: Yes, because I started like shortly after Penelope was born.

Dan: Talk about that a little bit.

’cause I think a lot of our users, and you guys can talk a little bit ’cause Ron has a family obviously as well.

Mike: Yeah.

Dan: Um, you guys can talk about. You know, the finding time because you had a W2, Mike’s an engineer, uh, or as of recently not an engineer anymore, but he’s by trade was a, um, developer, correct?

Mike: Yeah. Software developer,

Dan: software developer. Yeah. So he had that going on with the family and then the land business as well. And a lot of people listening are in that same situation and, uh, have families and all that. So talk about that, that journey.

Mike: Uh, number one, I would say if you’re doing this with a family, get your wife on board.

Yeah. Um, my wife Ariel being on board is huge because she would, you know, carve out time for me on the weekends. No, like we get the, I get the kids to bed and I’d have to go work. Um, so I, I, I’d say get your wife on board. Uh, that’s number one. Um, and they just find the time. Don’t make excuses if you need to get up early.

If you need, I mean, I would work a lot of nights. I would, we’d put my, I have two kids now, but initially I had one. Um, we put my daughter down at, you know, eight, eight 30 and I’d, I’d work till, uh, From there until 11. 30? You’ve always been a 9 0. Yeah. Yeah, I didn’t, I didn’t get up early

Dan: He watches his YouTube until one, 1 a. m. every night. I usually, uh, he was staying at my house one time. How do you know that? He was staying at my house one time in Florida and I was in an apartment at the time. It was when I first moved down and Mike and Ariel came before you had any kids. Yeah. And they came down and I’m like trying to sleep and I hear Jocko Willink like just motivational speech or something.

Cause the TV was against my wall. Yeah. It was like that TV was hung on my, on the wall to my bedroom. So I like heard Jocko Willink coming through and it was like 12 31 o’clock. And that’s how I got, he’s always educating yourself on different topics. I think. Yeah.

Mike: Before bed, I like comedy videos though.

They put me to sleep. Laugh a little bit and go to bed. But yeah. Yeah. Um, what were, what was the, what were

Dan: The original question was talking about family. You said, get your wife on board and then just find the time.

Mike: Yeah, I think that’s the biggest thing. Don’t make excuses. Find the time if you need to wake up early.

I did a lot more at night, but sometimes I’d wake up early too. Yeah. Um, but you can always wake up. I mean, land doesn’t take that much. Initially it takes more time, but it’s not that many hours, two hours, three hours a day. If you can get that much, that’s a lot. Yeah. Yeah. That’s probably even too much. And yeah, even two hours a day and then, um, find some time on the weekend.

You could, you know, get six to eight hours on the weekend and make good six figures.

Ron: Do you remember your, like your, uh, do you remember your goals when you first started land? Like as far as not financially, um, uh, as far as how long, if you wanted to eventually quit your job from land or something like that, do you remember when you first got in, like, what were you trying to get out of it?

Cause you had a secure in up till Monday, the last Friday, you had a very secure nine to five job. Um, so you’re going into, you did the same thing with drop shipping as far as you probably had a goal when you’re getting in there. Um, do you remember that when you were Getting into land because I think a lot of people can relate.

Uh, we’re two, three, two, three years in since you started land. You just quit your job. Some people it’s a longer journey. Some people, um, it’s risk tolerance too. But talk about your goal. If you can remember when you first got in.

Mike: Yeah, I, I don’t fully remember. I think I wanted to quit my job within like, I think I did want to go full time land at first and maybe within like six months to a year.

Uh, but my goals kind of changed when I, when I realized I could do the land. Because what was nice about doing land on the side was. I would, I was making money from land and not spending it. So I was just building up this capital. And now I’m in a position where I can fund my own deals because of that.

So I just kind of had like all this money building up on the side and I didn’t need to spend any of it. So that was, that was nice. And that’s why I stayed as long as I did. Um, but I mean, initially I went like all in on land. I, when I say 10, 15 hours a week, probably that first six months, I mean, I was working a lot and that’s when you’re learning.

I think that’s when you need to put the most work in because that’s when you develop the skills. And then once you have the skills, you can spend a lot more time, a lot less time on it because you’re more efficient. Um, but yeah, my goal has changed. Um, I, I never had like a hard goal though. I mean, initially it was really make, make extra money.

Um, Well, I wanted to make a lot more money. I saw how successful you guys were too, so I knew it worked. I think I had that advantage. You know, some people might come in a little bit skeptical, but like I saw the success you all were having, um, make sense. So yeah, I had big financial goals. The leaving was kind of,

Ron: yeah.

Mike: Change that.

Ron: The cool thing, Dan, is like, sorry, um, is like everyone we’ve had in the podcast chair have been like six months and seven months in like Michael’s had ups and downs and ups and downs and like seeing that rollercoaster because it is a rollercoaster. And again, it’s dependent on your situation too, but it’s not like this isn’t a, someone who’s been in this for six months.

It’s been multiple years, Michael in this. Um, so. I think kind of lessons and stuff like you can teach a lot of people as far as that and your situation. A lot of people come in with a kid, two kids. Uh, it’s all possible. It’s just another excuse maker, excuse thing.

Dan: It’s a lot of external factors .

People are looking for excuses and everything. And that’s what Mike’s done a really good job at. And I have this as a topic that we can kind of roll right into this is distractions. And, um, you’ve been one to win. Even I kind of push different things on you. Like texting and cold calling and all this, you’re like, I’m just going to stay focused on mail.

It’s working for me. It’s made me good money. Uh, it’s, it’s not a lot of man hours. And I know the system’s really well. Um, and also competition coming in where people are like, is it getting too competitive and all that? You don’t really listen to the noise with all that. So I wanted to segue from Ron, what he mentioned about that too.

When you first started also, and I was talking to Pete Reese about this, people were saying, is it too competitive? When we first started, people were like, is this space too competitive? Everyone’s always going to say that that’s the number one external excuse. But I wanted to get your thoughts on, you know, eliminating the distractions and just staying focused.

Mike: Um, I, I think the, the, the biggest thing was, um, Well, I, well, I saw it worked, the mailing worked and while doing this with a nine to five, I did only have one of the, one of the reasons why I cut out so many distractions was because I had the nine to five. I think if I was doing land full time, I would have brought in a lot more, but I knew mailing worked.

I knew it was very, very efficient and it’s probably the, I mean, it’s got to be one of the most time efficient ways to make money. Yeah. When you look at, you know, you send out mail, you, you know, you can send out 5, 000 months. I mean, sending out 5, 000 months, you can easily make six figures.

Dan: I mean, you, you, you’re talking thousand of dollars an hour.

Mike: Yeah. And you’re, and you’re only, maybe you get 30 calls back a male or 50, 30 calls back a mailer. Um, yeah. So, so, so it’s very time efficient, but the cutting out distractions a big piece of that, I think. Is just that I was so busy that I had to, I had no other choice. If I was going to make land work while having a family and doing a nine to five, like I had to be focused on one thing.

Dan: Yeah, no, that makes a lot of sense. And I think, um, for anyone starting out, like Mike said, you can pick up a lot of things that we’ve already talked about already. One, just putting a couple hours aside a day, no matter what, where you’re going to find it to getting your wife on board. I think that was a big one that I’ve never really heard you say, or, you know, people say, but having your wife behind you, whether they’re helping you kind of like Pete Reese yesterday, I was on Pete’s podcast and Pete’s and his family, his daughter works for him.

Yeah. His wife works with him. They do the, you know, whether it’s in your business or just supporting your business. So going from there, um, like we said, there’s so many external factors and distractions. Mike said, just kind of just stay focused, keep your head down, keep your mind on the goal and find ways to execute on that.

Mike recently was able to quit his nine to five job. And that was a goal of his to do. He kept his job for A decent amount multiple years while land investing and then found the right time and saved up, you know, over I think you said over a year of income and you know plenty other capital That’s a worst case scenario type stuff and you have deals in the pipeline and things like that as well But his journey of quitting took multiple years and he waited for the right the the beautiful thing about it Was that Mike like he said was able to save up money Because he wasn’t spending any of it.

So instead of living off your land income. You’re saving it up and Now you’re kind of using putting that as a safety barrier or buy your own deals and all that stuff Let’s talk about that journey because I was a mental journey for you the day before you quit You told me you were quitting and I was like, oh you usually tell me like six months in advance like oh I want to quit by December, you know, yeah, and I hadn’t heard it yet And then I told around I was like, yeah, Mike said he’s quitting tomorrow Um, there maybe was one or two days before, but let’s talk about that mental journey.

’cause that’s a big obstacle to over. That’s scary.

Yeah. Well, I was gonna wait to tell, I was gonna call you right after I quit. Mm-Hmm. to tell you. Mm-Hmm. Then I came to Dan, but then I started getting cold feet. So I was like, I better tell Dan. So I’m, I’m held accountable so whole because I knew you. I knew if I told you I was gonna do it, you’d start pushing me and you sent me like a few texts the next day.

Have you quit yet?

Mike: Yeah, but it’s uh, no, it’s hard. Um, yeah. Cause I’m pretty risk adverse. I always have a lot of backup plans. So this is like, I mean, I still have backup plans, but this is a pretty hard jump where to like go back and be hard. It’d be challenging. Um, so, so it’s, it’s exciting and scary. I think, I think playing out the worst case scenario really helps, especially when it’s not that bad when the worst case scenario is not bad.

Yeah. I mean, I’d have to get another job if everything. But you’re an engineer by trade. Yeah. So I’d be okay. I’d be okay. And you left your company. I could come live with him.

Dan: Yeah. Worst case scenario. Can like, you got to think of a worst case scenarios and like, yeah, you got family to back you if you actually absolutely need it.

Like if it got bad, like the worst. And when the worst case scenario in your situation, which I want you to talk about, like what is your worst case scenario? And it’s not that bad. So we can have the audience here.

Mike: I make no money for a year and a half. And I have to start looking for a job. I have about two years of income saved up.

So it’s not that bad. That’s not bad.

Dan: But people are like, I got one month to make this work. Yeah. You know, and they’re already living in their parents basement.

Mike: Yeah.

Dan: So your worst case isn’t that bad. And that’s what like Ron, when he started, you were a basketball coach, not making much money at the time you had money saved.

What was your worst case?

Ron: I mean, worst case is going to look for a job. Like I literally made 0 in the previous 12 months. Um, From anything I was working for free as a volunteer essentially the thing about the the the thing about this is it’s always like What’s your monthly expenses? Like how easy is it to recoup your monthly expenses doing something and like I was living in Very very rural, South Carolina.

My mortgage was 700 Legitimately 700 our expenses were under 1, 000 so like worst case scenario is going to find a job to like make 1, 200 and like That was before COVID and the, you know, in a really rough, not rough area, just a very, very rural area that not many people would know.

Dan: Yeah.

Ron: So, I mean, it’s, it’s all like, it’s all balanced.

I think Michael’s got, Rice and beans saved up for a couple of years, right?

Dan: Pantry stack.

Ron: Um, but uh, yeah. When you look at like worst case scenarios, stuff like this, like it just, it’s not that bad at the end of the day. And like what’s the best case scenario? The best case scenario is you do whatever the hell you want.

Um, as far as like traveling, running a business, hiring people with a business, and like you can grow a meaningful business, businesses, um, and like the upside is so much better. better. Like the downside’s not that bad.

Dan: The downside’s not bad at all. And like when I quit, you asked me about when I quit too, that I had, uh, money saved up, but like, we just believe so much in land at the time.

I didn’t, I didn’t sell my business yet. When, when I quit my job, I didn’t even have a family, but my expenses were decent. Cause I, So with spending too much money or more money than I probably should have at the time. But I think in general that, yeah, always look at your worst case scenario and then look at the upside and kind of weigh them against.

And once you feel good about your income you’re making from land for anyone listening versus the risk of quitting your nine to five, then I think that’s when it’s time to jump in. Everyone has a different risk profile, so that’s something to mention. But obviously you acquired droners. io with us. We went to Raleigh, did that.

We’re going to talk about that here soon. But before we get into that, What’s your plan for the next 12 months in terms of land?

Mike: I’m probably gonna I mean land’s gonna be pretty moderate right now, uh, be moderate Maybe three to four thousand mailers a month, maybe get up to five thousand Um, and what we talked about Dan, which i’m going to explore as well is Um targeting targeting large properties with a lot of road frontage, you know, 1500 2000 feet of road frontage offering maybe 70 75 um and just trying to get some big subdivide deals that can Have a potential for huge huge payoffs.

Dan: Everyone always asks me the secret and like what you said, and I try to tell our community the same things that I tell everyone and be as transparent as possible.

Like this is my brother. I’m telling him, he asked me or I told him, I said explore the idea of not doing 10, Don’t even send mail to him. Just explore that and stay hyper focused on the big deals with the road front. So in the LAN portal, if you guys are new or listening, there’s a road frontage minimum and maximum.

So you can target, it. 3, 000 to 6, 000 feet of road frontage between 50 to 100 acres and you’ll get these properties back that have Three sided road frontage and you can just split it up and subdivide and you can buy them at 75, 80, 130 percent and still make 300 percent. It’s it’s actually insane the amount of money you can make and Like, I just want to, uh, like this is something that I re that we recommended for Mike to do.

That’s how heavily we believe in it. Um, what, what’s your plan with that road frontage? Exactly.

Mike: I’m going to do it. I’m not going to stay hyper focused on it. Actually. I’m going to keep sending normal mail, uh, because that works. I mean, until that stops working, which I don’t think is anytime soon. I don’t think it’s too competitive.

Right. I think if you’re. If you know what you’re doing, you know, if you’re efficient, you know what you’re doing, you know how to talk to people on the phone, you can still make a ton of money on this. I mean, the biggest thing on the phone I think is building trust, building trust with the sellers. And if you can do that, well, you’re sending out enough mail, you’ll make money in this business.

Um, and then the, the, the bigger prop or the, um, big subdivide, that’s kind of, I’ll do that. I’ll do that on top of it. Um, because that’s not going to take up, I mean, you price those, you send them out, you’re not gonna get nearly as many calls from them. Um, But, but still shoot for him. It’s negotiation

Dan: though with them.

Cause you can go up. Yeah. Like that’s, you just want to get them on the phones essentially. And you might work them for two months, you know, and get it put earnest down to keep it. Cause it’s 240 grand, you know, and you’re splitting it up into 12 different lots and you’re going to sell it for eight 40.

Yeah. Like these deals are insane. It’s so easy. It’s so easy. I’m, I am making modules on it, but there’s three things you want to ask during this. And I told you those three questions. I don’t know if I’m going to be able to remember them now, but one was like, how small can you subdivide the lots until number two was Um, how many lots can I subdivide one parcel into?

Because sometimes they’ll say you can only sub one, uh, you can only subdivide one parcel into five lots. And the third was, does that create any restrictions when doing so? I think those were the three, but if you guys aren’t doing that, use the LAN portal and get that road frontage going, because there’s a ton of opportunities there.

I, you touched on being aggressive on the phone slightly. And that’s something in our program we were really working on for a long time. Um, I’m talking like a year or two ago when you were really, you hired a salesperson, you tried different sales techniques. This is actually a good topic to go into for everyone.

So Mike, let’s just call you a C salesperson before. Is that fair? That’s lower, higher. He’s going to get cocky and say B, a willing, a willing C, I think.

Mike: I don’t think I’m bad. I just don’t like it.

Dan: Yeah, so I but I do it because it’s not but before you got the reps and stuff. Yeah, you weren’t as you’re much more Confident on the phone people here.

I see C’s fair C was fair before that’s a

Mike: C looking to improve. Yeah

Dan: see looking to improve So let’s call him a C minus salesperson

Mike came and he was looking for ways to outsource and try it nice. We kind of had that discussion We said we could you can outsource And scale that way. Um, and that’s the route he went, or he can develop the skills you want. Outsourcing salespeople is. By Dan Martell standard and a lot of other people, one of the hardest positions to outsource outside of management just because you’re looking, it’s, it’s, it’s just difficult to get the people that the level quality people that you’re looking for.

And they’re highly compensated as well. So good salespeople. And it’s just a hard position to either alpha type personalities. A lot. It’s a hard position to outsource when you’re talking about an organization rather than a transaction coordinator or, you know, all the other roles in the organization or virtual assistants, things like that.

So you ended up outsourcing. Uh, at first, and then you changed, he came back from that, got rid of that. And you said, I’m just going to go from a C to a B plus or whatever it is. Talk about that and how you, uh, refined your skills with that and confidence.

Mike: I, I think outsourcing it. Really helped because then I was training somebody basically or I was training somebody and I was listening to their calls So going from going from just being kind of isolated salesperson to seeing it from a from a higher perspective I think that really helped me Yeah, cuz then I could see it like I could the salesperson I hired and it didn’t work out But a lot of it was my compensation model.

I don’t think I did it quite right, but but watching him Watching, you know, listening to his calls, watching what he did, and then saying, okay, I do that. I don’t like that. And kind of building my own skills from that.

Dan: Mm. Teaching is one of the best ways to for sure. To learn for sure. That’s how we learn a lot.

And that’s like Anthony and I can’t remember who said that, um, the other day, but one of the things we do with virtual assistants sometimes, or whatever, you tell them to teach you an alum video, how to do it and make the SOPs, that’s like one of the steps. Mm-Hmm. , you know, make the review guidelines. Yeah.

And then once they can do it and they

Ron: can teach someone that just refines deeper. Teaching’s a ama. Like that’s what I’ve done for the last 10 years. Teach, um, and like teaching helps so much with all this stuff. If it’s teaching my son how to play chess, like it helps me or just teaching him, we kind of will learn side by side.

It’s whatever it is. Mm-Hmm. teaching is the best way to, he refine your skills. He does what he does. Whoop me. He Whoops. Michael too. . Yeah. He is good. Not anymore .

Dan: That’s his confidence. He gets whooped. But, um, anything else on that topic, Ron? No, I think that’s good. All right. Well, now we’re going to get into, I think that’s a good segue for droners.

io. Mike is the tech CEO of droners. io. He likes that title. He requested me to use it before. No, I’m just kidding. But that droners. io you were using before you, you, you acquired it, right?

Mike: Yeah. Yeah. We were all using it for, for drone photography for our land. Not just photography, but for due diligence.

Dan: And you liked it?

Loved it. Is that why you wanted to buy it? Yeah. Talk about that whole process of identifying and executing that plan.

Mike: Of acquiring?

Dan: Just acquire the whole

Mike: process. Yeah. Okay. It started, it started on a call with you, Dan, where we started talking about acquisition entrepreneurship. Um, and then after that call, I read a book called, um, bill or buy then build.

Uh, and within a few days I decided I was going to buy a business. I didn’t know what. And then I had a call with Ron the next week and he brought up, it’s like, do you want to buy, do you want to buy droners dot? He’s like, I wonder if they’re selling droners. io. I’d be interested in buying that. And then I kind of, I don’t even think I said anything.

Um, but right after that call, I started looking, uh, and I went on to, uh, I tried calling the old, the parent company, donors that I owe numbers down, uh, should we say, yeah, precision Hawk. Um, tried emailing. I went on LinkedIn. I bought a premium membership. I, I messaged their old CEO. He told me, he told me he couldn’t help me, uh, message a bunch of people.

And eventually I found this guy, there was a company that merged with precision Hawk a few years ago and I found the CEO of that company and I messaged him. Where were they? I think Sweden. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Overseas. Um, and he seemed to like me. He’s like, let me see if I can help you out. And I talked to his attorney and his attorney said, Oh, there’s a attorney said there’s a trustee in charge of liquidating the precision hockey state.

And he gave me his email. I emailed this trustee. Um, and then, and then from there we had to, uh, he, he basically said we have to bid on it. He said, there’s one other bid, or I don’t know if he told me how many bidders, but he, he, he sent me some financials back. And he said, if you’re interested in, in. Uh, interested in this, you have to bid on it and you have to bid 5, 000 higher or 10, 000 higher than the previous bid.

And from there it’ll trigger an auction in Raleigh, North Carolina, in person, in person auction auction. So while that’s going on, I’d like sent Ron a text. I was like, are you actually interested in buying droners. io? And you said, yes. It’s like, okay, I’m talking to some people now. Um, and then Dan, you were also, you were also interested.

Um, so we ended up, we got together, we got an, we hired an attorney. And we ended up putting it, we put in a qualified bid. The last possible day you could, it was Friday. It was a Monday morning. Was it Friday? Well, I thought

Dan: Friday and we had to go Monday.

Mike: No, I thought we put the bid in Monday and we had to go Tuesday.

Dan: Oh, we tried to put in Friday, but the attorney was out of the office, right?

Mike: Yeah. Something went on. We didn’t, we didn’t mean to hold it all the way to the end. I mean, we kind of did, but we didn’t mean to go.

Dan: It was one of our strategies we talked about, but

Mike: I didn’t mean to, I didn’t mean to go that far, but it ended up, we were looking over some numbers and stuff too, but anyway, so we put in a bid Qualified been Monday morning.

We made sure it’s like, okay, the auctions on now on Tuesday morning. So we, we bought plane tickets for that evening. We all flew out. Dan got us a janky hotel with construction going.

Dan: How did we come up with that? This thing, Oh God, the construction, we’ll get into all of that. But before you keep going real quick, that hotel, um, so they, I was in Raleigh, North Carolina, and I, I remember Ron walking through those sliding doors when you first came in, but I want to talk about the timeframe because this happened quick.

You didn’t touch on the timeframe from those emails and figuring this out. How long was this process? A couple of weeks. It was literally like two weeks.

Mike: I like, I decided I was going to buy a business and within three weeks we had a business.

Dan: Yeah. And by the time we got all of it, but when you got a hold of the sweet until we even knew the qualified bidder, it was like a week in the head, right?

Mike: We didn’t have much time. We

Dan: didn’t have time. Yeah. And then, which is good ’cause we surprised him. We knew the auction had to be live pretty or in person like a week or so. Mm-Hmm. in advance. So we’re like, in the back of our heads, we’re like, we’re gonna have to go to Raleigh. So Tuesday. I, I remember waking up Tuesday morning, so Monday we put in the bid Tuesday and we contacted the attorney and we’re like, Hey, like, we just wanna confirm we have to come tomorrow, right?

Or is that Monday? ,

Mike: No, no, that was Monday. And we had to show up Tuesday. We put in the bid Monday morning. Then we got a confirmation that the auction was on. Yes. And then we’re like, okay. And then we booked tickets. Like it was like Monday or late morning. We booked flights for Monday evening. That’s, we flew to Raleigh that night.

Yeah. Monday night we flew to Raleigh. Stayed in that hotel. And then we had an auction in the morning. .

Dan: Yeah. Um, that’s when I introduced Mike to white noise. ’cause there’s a jackhammer going on outside.

Ron: I wanted the Airbnb the whole time. Like I was telling you I was texting,

Dan: I said Airbnb doesn’t work for one night. The stay in the city at the hotel

Ron: No, it worked fine. I would’ve, we would’ve had a nicer, no, we could’ve just had a nicer hotel. Good sleep. But, um, one thing I wrote down here, Dan, and we talk about it so much, is like friction creates opportunity. Like those are the exact words I wrote down and this was not.

Like what I was thinking when Mike was telling this story, it’s like, how many people would have bid on this if it was like, posted on Instagram, like, show up to Raleigh courthouse, bid on Dreamers. Might as well call it off market. You know what I’m saying? But, um, like how much friction Michael had to, to, uh, to just get to that lobby in that foreclosure, uh, courthouse or whatever you want to call it.

Like there was a ton of friction reaching out to people, people telling them to F off, uh, because their business, uh, went bankrupt essentially. Like there was a lot of friction to get there. We’ve talked to other people who have said they want, they were interested in it and curious to see what was going on.

But the work that was put in previously to actually get there was huge.

Mike: It was basically like you said, an off market deal and the friction, Yeah, I love the friction because it kept out the competition. I think the more friction you have in business, two bidders, that’s all there. I talked to some other people that tried to bid, but they didn’t have enough money.

There were some other, yeah, they’d actually went to the auction. There were two of us. There were, there were a few people that put in like lower bids from what, but yeah, basically

Dan: Pete said he inquired about this yesterday on his podcast and it’s going on his, so you guys will hear it on there too, if you guys listen, but he said that, um, Yeah, he, a great customer.

He said, he said he’s the one at the top. I didn’t confirm that with Mike, but we don’t need to go into numbers. But he said how he was looking to do it and there was friction and he never heard back. Yeah. And that was part of the friction that kept Pete out. And I told Pete, I said, you probably had a lot more money than the other droner guys we were bidding against.

I said, we would have merged or something. Cause we don’t want to create a bid war.

Ron: Um, land people would have been all over it. Like there’s multiple, there’ve been five, six land, uh, investors, education,

Dan: Hundred percent. Would not have been hard to do. And, um, so we talked about the acquisition process. I think they got a good understanding of that from what we’ve talked about.

Yeah. I want to get into. post acquisition, um, going into just actually taking it over. Cause that’s when the real work started getting there. It was fun. I guess we didn’t talk about the courtroom and all that. Let’s talk about the actual bidding process a little bit more because, you know, we woke up, we still didn’t know what number we were going with.

Or a max number. We all thought we had kind of max numbers, but it’s like, if it got there, I was going to go higher. A hundred percent.

Ron: I was scared of our max number that we said, though, like our, we got it for 60 percent of what our max number was, but we had no clue. Like, because the numbers are the numbers and we knew the potential.

And I think we kind of, what I was saying to Daniel, I don’t know when it was, maybe it was you, I don’t know, but we kind of put the business on a pedestal because how much we used it. And like, we used it a ton. Um,

Dan: And it was good technology too. A hundred percent. But we were sitting at first in Raleigh, North Carolina.

And I remember being like, okay, so what’s our maximum? And we never came to a conclusion. And that’s what always worried me going into that court house is because we did not have a defined end number. And I think it just shows how bad we really wanted it because we used it and we believed in the software and the future of it so much.

But I just remember not having a clear number what we were going to.

Ron: So the day of. We talked about what our top number was. And again, we didn’t know and I in the back of my, we wanted to win this. Like it felt like a fight. We’re going into almost, um, and we were talking like the adrenaline that I remember you talked about the adrenaline you had, um,

Dan: My heart was beating. My watch told me I was at like 128 beats per minute. Like I was in a sports game. I, I heard it beating, like when we were auctioning, I don’t know why I was like looking around, I was like, it’s common here. I don’t know why you guys feel that too or was it just me?

Ron: No, there’s a lot going on and we’re excited.

Mike: You’re both are , super nervous.

I was kind of chilling. Yeah. I was excited though.

Ron: It wasn’t your money.

Dan: It wasn’t your damn monday. So the deal we worked out, Ron and I paid 100 percent of the money for Mike to run it because Mike was looking to acquire a business. So we’re like, Mike’s the operator and he’s going to run the business and he’s got the tech background and the, I shouldn’t say tech, the engineering, data engineering background so he could take it over and do all of the work and all that with it.

Mike: Yeah. No, it’s a great deal to basically I do the work. I get 33 percent of the business without money. So it’s, I mean, I think it’s a win win. You guys don’t have the time to work.

Dan: It’s definitely a win win. And it’s hard to find a qualified, trusted, uh, operator from, from our perspective to, yeah.

Ron: And, uh, yeah, we, I mean, going to that courthouse.

So we were, Mike was late to get to the lobby. Coming down to the lobby from the, uh, we’re waiting for

Dan: I’m like combing my hair in the mirror, I remember, and you’re like pacing back and forth.

Ron: But we were waiting to go to the courthouse, and we got to the courthouse, like, holy crap, like, this is a federal courthouse.

This wasn’t like a, uh

Dan: Chapter 7 in Raleigh North Carolina,federal court.

Ron: Yeah, this was a federal, like, there’s not that many of them, so like, we got in there and like Metal detector turn in your phone do this all these different things that we had to do and that’s when like I think some more Nerves hurt hit me like security all over the place, which is not like it’s security for us It’s just making sure everything checks But Mike you want to talk about when we kind of got up there too.

We weren’t bidding in a big courtroom We’re bidding in a hallway.

Mike: Yeah, there was there was something going on in the courtroom So there was a judge’s oversaw this but we were we were just in a hallway

Dan: And because he wanted to keep it more relaxed. He’s like, I don’t like courtrooms personally. He’s like, I’ve been an attorney a long time.

Let’s just keep it casual.

Ron: This is the trustee. His job is to get as much money for the commission from it or the bankruptcy as possible.

Mike: He’s getting paid to do that. Uh, yeah. The more, the more money that, that he sells liquidates, the more he gets paid. Yeah. Yeah. Um, yeah. So we’re in this hall and yes, I was a couple minutes late, but that the attorney for the other bidder was also like 50 minutes later than us.

Yeah. Um, but we were also, yeah, it was, it was, uh, It was interesting experience because none of us were expecting. It was, it was a lot more official than we thought. It’s awesome. We’re in this federal bankruptcy building where, yeah, like Ron said, we’re coming in, we’re putting our stuff in metal detectors.

You guys are going up first. They’re holding me back and then I get up. Um, but yeah, I honestly, I was there kind of as an observer because you guys were in it and I was giving advice, but, but Ron, you two were kind of like, okay, we’re going to bid this much. We’re going to bid this much. And I kind of, I said a little bit, but not a whole lot because it was your money.

So it was, it was kind of, um, gave my opinion, but it was, I mean, it was, it was up to you guys. Um, but then the, the, the bids, the bid started at, what do they start at 75?

Dan: Yes. They’re like 75.

Mike: So we’re great. We’re just standing in a hallway. It’s the two of us, it’s the three of us, an attorney and, and the trustee, and then attorney for this other company bidding, bidding on it.

So we started at, I think it started, started low, maybe 65, Um, we went up in small increments and then Ron did a big jump on the bid and the attorney said, okay, we have to, I have to call my client. He walks out, And we’re expecting to be back in three minutes. He was gone for 15, 20 minutes. It was easy.

Yeah. So we’re talking this whole time. It’s like, he’s been gone forever. Let’s do one more job.

Dan: This waiting time sucked too. Cause it’s like so much anticipation coming. It’s like, what are they going to come back at? But yeah,

Mike: But it was also meant they were like on the fence.

Dan: They were calling their wives for them to be gone 15 minutes.

I told them you guys too. Yeah. When we’re sitting there, I was like, these guys are calling their wives, their family, collecting, you know, money, trying to get investors. We were over the number that they initiated. They had a threshold and they hit a threshold. And then, uh, their attorney needed to go get permission to go up and see what they wanted to do, essentially.

Mike: Yeah. And so, so we did that and he comes back. Just 5, 000 higher minimum higher than what we did and it was like after 20 minutes and we already made a plan and then Ron did another jump big big jump and he walks out again and he comes back says congratulations business is yours

Dan: And and there’s case studies on that on you know Jump auctioneers wants you to get in the smallest increments 5, then you work your way up hundreds of thousands of dollars Yeah, and then Or you can just jump them off the bat and try to scare people Yeah, and there’s some case studies on that You Going back, do you like the strategy we used?

Mike: I think you could have paid less, but I think it won.

Dan: It did. It won at a price 60 percent lower than what we thought. Yeah. What we would go up to. What we would, what our maximum was. You would have gone up another, you would have doubled that value. I would have not wanted to be there for that.

Mike: No, it was good. It worked. I mean, yeah. We would put them on the fence, and then, the good thing about the initial first jump, too, is we knew, Then we know it’s like, okay, they’re, they’re like on the edge right now. We can just one more bit and we’ll knock them out.

Ron: Yeah. I’ve thought, have you thought about it? Well, I’ve thought about that process quite a bit in the last few months.

When was it, Mike? Was it March?

Mike: No, it was April because we officially. Officially owned it April 26th. Mm-Hmm. . And I think that was maybe a week. It was a week before or so.

Ron: Yeah. I’ve thought about it a lot. Like the process, like if we did thero wrong thing, jumping up at like, it’s not that much money. We, we own the asset, like the asset we own now.

And like what it can be is like what I always kind of,

Dan: And it’s not, it’s not like that the percent we paid over, uh, what we could have got it for. I think it was small.

Ron: Yeah. And that’s, it’s worth way, way more than that asset as a whole, just where it is right now. But I think you want it to get into future things.

 

Dan: Yeah. I want to get into, um, I wanted to go into taking it over in the logistics, but I don’t know if we need to get into that more. So then let’s, let’s hear how it’s doing now first, and then we’re going to get into future plans.

Mike: Okay. Yeah. I mean the logistics, I’ll just, I’ll say real short. It was tough because we’re taking, we were taking a company over that was bankrupt for six months.

So it was, is run by a bankrupt company. The payment processor has. Thousands of accounts, pilot accounts on it. Just getting access to that took three weeks and there’s probably 50 accounts. I needed access to like, it was, it’s not like, it’s not like acquiring an asset where you have, you’re working with the old owner, it’s, it’s acquiring a bankrupt backside.

You’re trying to, I’m finding old employees on LinkedIn. I was finding old employees on LinkedIn and asking to help me with.

Dan: That’s the risk. Also that when you’re buying a bankrupt company, why you get it for. pennies on a dollar of what it’s worth is because of the risk associated with what you’re getting how You know, this has been bankrupt a while now.

It’s like what who are you working with? How’s this transition? What are the numbers? They think the numbers are here. So that was part of the risk, too

Ron: Yeah, we uh, we knew we knew their numbers and we also made sure we weren’t taking on any of their liabilities That’s what I was very like And guys like this isn’t they weren’t transferring over a Wix site or a Shopify site.

They were transferring over lines of code. Um, and like, it wasn’t like some clean website transfer. Like this is a completely

Dan: It was a custom build,

Ron: custom built website that was being transferred over. And that was the part that made me nervous as well. Getting that.

Mike: Yeah. It’s a tech, it’s a tech business and it’s, yeah, it was all software.

Dan: Absolutely. Well, let’s talk about the, you know, getting it up the first month results. You don’t need to go into specific numbers or anything like that, but just talk about, you know, getting up and running, have you retained a lot of the customers who, who got off the platform and since then, you know, improvements and things to today’s results.

Mike: Initially it was about the software migration that took about three weeks, but once we’re up and running, um, I, I started reaching out to our top clients. or the previous top clients, um, trying to retain, trying to get everybody back. It was about letting everybody know if the main thing was initially it wasn’t new clients.

It was letting everybody know because it was, the site was working while precision Hawk was bankrupt, but it wasn’t very good. There were problems. So letting everybody know we’re back up and running. We have a full customer support staff. We have a full technical staff. Um, we’re putting these improvements in.

So it’s really just letting all of our current clients know that we’re up and running again and getting them back. Um, and that happened quickly. I mean, we grew. Uh, I mean, our revenue has been going up steadily every month since then.

Dan: Yeah. And a lot of that was just, you know, being trusted again. There’s some other competitors coming into space, trying to take it.

They weren’t good. And we found out quick competition was weak and they’re expensive and they were expensive, but I think that’s less of the problem than actually being weak.

Mike: Yeah. I mean, I think, I mean, we have the best soft, we have better software than all our competition or the best software. Um, and we have the brand recognition, so getting people back.

Um, yeah, but I mean, I think with, with a tech business, it’s all about the product. Right. There’s a lot of, you can, you can do ads, but having the best product is crucial. And that’s that. And you’ll get a lot more word of mouth that if you have, if you have software business, it’s not good. It’s not going to work.

Dan: So percentage wise, like where that first month verse where you’re at today, what’s revenue look like?

Mike: Well, we’ve made some, we’ve made some changes. Uh, it, it’s about doubled.

Dan: It’s about over three months, four months.

Mike: Yes. But it’s, but profit has, uh, more than tripled, tripled

Dan: Profits tripled . And let’s get into that because We’re all about transparency here.

Um, in our businesses, it’s actually one of our core of round and ice core values at the land investing online or other companies, but The this business was trying to operate off 15 percent 10 10 10 percent margins Not including striped fees everything so really 7 so 10 percent they were taking from the client side pilot from the pilot side and the Anyone in business with the business mind knows you’re not going to live off 10%.

I still think we need to find ways to increase that, but that’s, you’re going to die. Like you cannot operate off 7%. So let’s talk about what we did.

Mike: Yeah. I mean, that’s 7 percent gross margins without operating expenses.

 

Dan: So youre looking at 2 percent net, you’re making a, you’re making nothing.

It is a, it was a charity. You can’t scale, you can’t hire, you can’t add, you can’t do anything with that. It’s charity. This, that was a charity site.

Mike: Yeah. So we knew right away that wouldn’t work. We didn’t make the change right away because we were bringing in a few thousand dollars a month for a little more than that.

But, um, so what we decided to do is that a 10 percent gross margin, fee on the client side as well.

Ron: So that was first was a droner to clarify guys. First, the 10 percent we had was charging to the drone pilots.

Mike: Yes. Yeah. It was taken out of the drone pilots. That’s how it’s been for since 2015. Um, so we made a 10 percent fee on the client side.

Um, just, I mean, a big part of it. So now we have money for development. We have money for ads. You know, we’re spending thousands a month on paid ads. We’re spending thousands a month on development. Um, cause I, I’m very focused on, on improving the product and now we have, have the money to do that.

Dan: It gives us, it’s capitalism.

I mean, now we have money to put into ads to get more clients to make the drones happier. The droners are more happy on the, uh, the clients are happy cause they have a better product. Everyone’s making more money because of that. So it’s like, it’s helping them help themselves essentially.

Ron: Yeah. Every single site that brokers work, Every single one, Upwork, Fiverr, uh, DoorDash, all these sites, like they’re making money on both sides.

It’s just, no one else isn’t.

Dan: Yeah, and I’m not for just raising, uh, Your commissions when it’s unjustified, but it was justified there and the more value put in you can come up with other ways to create, you know, the better product you have and better exclusive things that come up on the, you can always, you could put different things into monetize to help them help themselves essentially.

So it’s a win win and that’s what you can’t just add fees on things when it’s not a win win. It always has to be a win win for the drone photographers. It’s a win win now because we can advertise and get more clients, more clients than ever are coming to droners. io. So that’s number one. Number two, the clients were putting in all that money, that revenue that we’re getting now in that profit into the site and we’re blasting the site.

We’re getting that scaled up. We’re getting that really nice. And then their experience is better as well. They’re getting people hired. Good. You know, everything’s good.

Mike: Yeah. So, so the client side feed, I mean, most people understood a few people complain. And when I explained it, the why like everybody’s like, Oh yeah, that makes sense.

Cause it just doesn’t make sense. We wouldn’t be here off 7 percent or we wouldn’t have a business. So if you want this business to be around, yeah, we would die without it.

Dan: Yeah. I think that’s pretty understable.

Mike: Yeah.

Dan: Yeah. Um, what about future plans for the site? Any major changes? Not from a financial profit thing, just from like, you know, we are number one goal, same as with the land portal.

So we own the land portal as well, which is a software site for those who don’t know. So it’s a tech company. And um, I understand what Mike’s saying. Like when the, when the, product improves, you just, that’s, that’s how the business grows. It’s like marketing works with the product and exponentially grows and word of mouth and all of that.

So do you have any things coming up that anyone needs to know about?

Mike: Um, I mean, right now we’re working on, we’re adding, adding some new features. Like when you post a job, you can now, um, when this comes by the time this comes out, you’ll be able to add eight attachments. Uh, I’m trying to think of that. We have, we have a few different features coming in.

We’re doing some behind the scenes as well. Uh, doing, adding, uh, something called Uh, auto scaling on AWS or just some server side stuff. So the performance is better. Um, and we’ll compute and I want to do a mobile app as well. Um, so that should be probably next year. Uh, we haven’t started on that yet, but next year we want to add a mobile app.

That’s a request we’ve been getting. Um, but just, just continue to, uh, what, what, like I sent out a feedback survey the other day and just continue to take feedback. The biggest thing is taking feedback from the client, seeing what they want. Um, and then implementing that. Cause I think initially I was like, we were looking at things, Putting in improvements.

It’s like, what, what are the clients actually want? Exactly. So it’s, it’s asking clients as much as we can getting, seeing what they want and putting those improvements in as fast as possible.

Dan: Yeah. So if you guys are on YouTube or Spotify and can comment and you guys have used this software, let us know what you guys want.

Like the same thing with the LAN portal. Like I, I don’t create the direction of the LAN portal. I listen and have such a tight grip on it that I know what people want and you’re doing the same exact thing.

Mike: Yeah, absolutely.

Dan: So taking that feedback.

Ron: I don’t have anything else. I don’t think Mike. Um, yeah, I think, yeah.

Dan, when I talked about it, like it was probably, I don’t know, maybe a month after something like, like you’ve taken this head on and like, you’ve moved fast with it. And that’s when I think like the, like the speed we’ve taken, you’ve taken over this and like grown it and, uh, the different things you’re learning about email marketing, you’re learning about, uh, Google ads, Facebook ads, all these different things.

Like it’s a, I’m really excited to see the future of it.

Dan: Yeah. And the, the people have a misconception on drones, what they’re used for in the land space. People think they’re used for land. Yeah. I don’t even vision droners. io as necessarily, uh, a land photographer business. I think that’s thinking micro this, like the people that are using the droners and whoever’s really starting to scale is like, if you guys have wedding events, roofers.

Um, inspection companies. Talk about some of the big clients that are, that, you know, the really big clients that are putting jobs up that aren’t land associated.

Mike: Yeah, we for sure have our land investors. I mean, a lot, a lot of commercial real estate. So commercial real estate is really big. Cause you can’t just get up on the roof and start walking.

It’s just, they’re big. For photos do, um, a lot, we have some big roof inspecting companies that, that use this, uh, survey and mapping. That’s a big one. Those are, those are, but yeah, those are probably the main ones that the real estate, not just land though. It’s much more than just land construction, like big construction sites.

Yeah. You’re hiring people for big construction. Yeah. We have more.

Dan: Yeah. That’s real estate, but it’s building.

Mike: Yeah. It’s different. It’s different than land though. Um, yeah. And then surveys and mapping. So they, people hire, um, like survey companies will hire droners to help them with their, to do their surveys and do their mappings.

And then events as well.

Dan: For the , uh, uh, Ben’s in here, our videographer, we’re looking to do a pond on our Kentucky property. Okay. So we might need a little survey and outline it and all that stuff from the droners. io. But yeah, if you guys like are buying assets or evaluating things outside of land as well, um, that, uh, it’s a huge segment and it’s very, very scalable as well.

Like you said, lands definitely the, uh, would you say it’s the number one thing for land now? What’s number one? Yeah. Commercial real estate.

Mike: That’s wild. I didn’t even know that. Did you know like buildings and stuff? Yeah. We have one six figure client. Yeah. Commercial real estate.

Ron: I see stuff like some of the stuff I see is like going through warehouse, like you can do in these pilots are so damn good.

Like they can go through warehouses. I saw one that was making like a commercial, like flying through a warehouse, um, like through all the shelving and stuff like it’s sick. What you can do with these things.

Dan: Yeah. It makes a lot of sense with commercial real estate. That’s interesting. I learned something new here, but any last comments.

So like, just to summarize everything we talked about. Uh, with Mike here, he started in, uh, just a vending company, vote to drop shipping, uh, transition to land investing, and now, uh, owns a tech company with us. And, um, just evaluating and seeing opportunities and running full force with them. I think it’s what you can learn.

And you can do this when you’re busy and have a family and have a W2 job. So there are no real excuses in this business. It’s just about taking action, but. Mike, do you have anything else to add before we close this out?

Mike: Yeah. I mean, I think if you have entrepreneurial aspirations, um, take a shot at it because you’ll regret it.

If you don’t, that was the biggest thing. Cause I worked in that. I had a great job. Um, didn’t hate it or like a lot of entrepreneurs didn’t hate it, but I felt like I was settling and I needed to give this a shot. So if you have those, those goals, I mean, lands a great way. There’s many different ways.

Land’s a great way. But if you have those entrepreneurial goals, um, take a shot. Uh, cause the worst case scenario is not that bad. Usually.

Ron: Absolutely. Absolutely. I don’t have anything to add. I appreciate Mike. Thank you guys. Other than that, guys. Thank you so much for watching. If you’re watching on YouTube, subscribe below, leave us a message in the comments.

If you have any questions about droners. io, if you have any topics for future podcast episodes, if you’re watching on Spotify or Apple, share this with a friend, put in our Instagram story. We appreciate it so much. Thank you so much. We’ll see you next time. Thanks for joining guys.

Dan: As always, thank you for joining.

Please do us a huge favor and like and subscribe our YouTube channel and share this with a friend. It really means the world to Ron and I. But more importantly, it could help change the life of someone else. Thanks for joining and we’ll see you next episode.

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